Podcast Interview: Anne Janzer 04/12/2023 - The book marketing marathon: How to pace yourself to avoid burnout

Carla King interviews Anne Janzer: The book marketing marathon: How to pace yourself to avoid burnout.

Nonfiction Authors Association Podcast | April 12, 2023

“Just try to approach book promotion and book marketing with the same creativity that you approach writing your book. I think that’s my best advice. And try to put it in that framework, because too often we feel stressed out about it. And if we say, ‘Wait, no, I’m going to be creative. I’m going to experiment. This will be fun and interesting,’ it changes our relationship to it, and it becomes something that we can really inhabit in our writing lives.”
-Anne Janzer

About Anne Janzer

Anne Janzer is a nonfiction book coach and the author of six books about writing and marketing. With a background in marketing, she constantly experiments with book promotion, and loves to share those findings with other authors. Her writing books explore the science and practices behind successful writing, and include The Writer’s Process, Writing to Be Understood, and Get the Word Out. She will lead a session on Discount Book Promotions to Boost Sales and Reviews at the Nonfiction Writer’s Conference in May, 2023.

Nonfiction Authors Podcast: Anne Janzer

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Show Notes

Links

In this episode…

Why authors may get stressed when thinking about book marketing.
How to know what kind of book launch you should have as an author.
Ways to strategize and prioritize tasks when marketing your book.
Tips on finding balance when focusing on marketing your book.
The meaning behind the servant authorship philosophy.
Advice on tracking sales and setting healthy parameters when watching for growth.
How to approach book marketing on social media.
What Anne will be presenting at the 2023 Nonfiction Writers Conference.

Transcript

Hello and welcome to the Nonfiction Authors Podcast. Today’s session is with Anne Janzer to talk about your book marketing marathon and how to pace yourself to avoid burnout.

Anne Janzer is a nonfiction book coach and the author of six books about writing and marketing for authors. With a background in marketing, Anne constantly experiments with book promotion and loves to share those findings with other authors. Her books explore the science and practices behind successful writing, and include The Writer’s Process, Writing to Be Understood, and Get the Word Out. You’ll find Anne next month to lead a panel discussion at the Nonfiction Writer’s Conference on Discount Book Promotions to Boost Sales and Reviews. Don’t miss it, it’s coming up in late May 2023.

Welcome, Anne. I’m so excited about your talk today, and the Writers Conference next month. Book marketing is always a challenge for authors, and we so appreciate your expertise.

Anne Janzer 1:37

I’m delighted to be here. Thanks, Carla.

Carla King 1:39

And I’ve known you via podcasts, and group meetings and stuff for years. And you have this unique ability to help authors relax during the journey. And we so appreciate that. Why do you think we get so stressed? We know it’s coming for a long time. So, how can we relax? Why do we get stressed about it?

Anne Janzer 2:05

So we get stressed about book marketing for so many reasons. One is that–for most of us, it’s an entirely new set of skills. We’ve just finished this amazing thing, which is writing a book, right? If it’s your first book, it’s this huge accomplishment. And now you’re back to near the absolute beginner in the next phase, which is book marketing. So that’s one thing–is it’s all new. And another thing is that you hear so much advice out there. And it doesn’t all fit you, but you don’t know. You don’t know what fits or not. So there’s a million things that you could be doing. And honestly, Carla, I still struggle a little bit with this. Keeping it balanced, putting aside all the things I know I “should be doing,” and keeping an open mind, but just trying to keep an even keel. Because, otherwise, this could subsume me and I could stop writing, which is not what I want to do. I know that I’m not alone in that. I know you probably have experienced that same thing, too. That, ‘Am I doing enough?,’ feeling.

Carla King 3:11

I know. I feel like I’m missing out on so much all the time. I’m not on BookTok, my Facebook author page is out of date–all of that.

Anne Janzer 3:21

Okay, so what I want to do today is give you–and everyone listening–a little bit of peace, a little bit of understanding about how to go forward to get through this. Because this is definitely a marathon, and not a sprint. And that’s the thing we need to keep in mind. And if you burn out–doesn’t matter. Nothing matters if you burn out.

Carla King 3:43

And we’re told to start really early–like a year or two before our book is done, or whenever we think of the book. And it’s true, we should start a mailing list, and get on the social media sites, and all that. So hopefully we’re a little bit used to it by the time the book comes out. But there are authors who do that. And then authors who write a book and then they’re like, ‘Whoa! I have a book. Now what?’ Right?

Anne Janzer 4:06

Right? Start from where you are. I mean, that’s what you need to do–is start from where you are. I do spend a lot of time talking with people around book launches, because that–the launch topic–is so fraught with, ‘What should I be doing?’ Like, a million things. And you talk to this friend who did this, long book signing tour, and you talk to this friend who did this thing and gave a series of talks. And you sit and think, ‘Oh my gosh, how am I ever gonna do this?’

So we also have to understand that not all books are the same. Not all publishing paths are the same. If you are talking to a lot of people who were traditionally published–and maybe even traditionally published 5-10 years ago, when the retail market was how traditional publishers focused–yes, there’s a ticking clock. Because the bookstore will return those books after three months. If they haven’t been selling, the bookstores return them.

So if you’re traditionally published and really hoping for the big retail channel, then yes, you really do need a big launch to try to get a lot of attention in the first few months of the book. The rest of us–it’s great to have a good launch. But time is also on our side. And we can take the time to build the audience, and to build our platform. And that’s okay, too. That’s a perfectly legitimate way to go. That’s really how I built my writing platform–slow and grow.

Carla King 5:36

Slow and grow–I love it. So by the rest of us, you mean those of us who are committed to independent publishing, or self publishing?

Anne Janzer 5:44

Indie, or self, or even hybrid publishing, where it’s not all about sales through retail. And by retail, I mean brick and mortar bookstores, right? It’s not all about that. And if your topic is not super timely–I mean, if you’re writing a chatGPT book right now, I’d be like, ‘Yeah, do a big launch, because it’s going to change a year from now–maybe a month from now.’ But the brick and mortar bookstores do want the new, new thing. And so for them, you often really do have to focus on getting traction right away. But with hybrid presses, and other kinds of books, we have more time. And indie authors.

Carla King 6:26

I have this long book launch checklist that I’ve compiled over years. And I realized that when I launch a book, I often leave half of the things out, or even three quarters of the things out. Because it’s a list of possibilities, really.

Anne Janzer 6:49

Yes.. So there’s a couple of practices there. One is–first, make a checklist and repeat. Wherever we can make processes out of in our book marketing is good, because you don’t want to keep reinventing the wheel. What I’ve learned to do with my book launch checklist is–I color code it. I say, ‘Essentials–these are the things I have to do. If I don’t do this, the book is..’ –things that I really, really want to do. The core of my book launch, and then optional extras. So I give myself immediate permission to say, ‘If this slides off the plate, that’s okay.’ Because I focus on that middle part, which is playing to my strengths, right?

Here’s my piece of advice, no matter where you are–if you’re launching or if you’ve already got a book out, and you’re trying to figure out, ‘How should I spend my time marketing?’ One is–play to your strengths. I had someone say, ‘Here’s my success–I load the trunk of my car with my books, and I drive to museums all over, and everyone I see.’ And this guy just loved talking to people. And I would just throw myself off a cliff before I did what he did. That is not my strength. I’m not doing that. So play to your strengths. I would rather see every author choose one or two things that they’re going to do really, really well. And that can be your book marketing strategy. That can be your launch platform. It’s–you have a community of people. Really work that community. If you do a good job speaking, do a podcast tour and get on podcasts, or start your own podcast. Pick one or two things and do them really well.

In addition to essentials–maybe emails to your list, things like that. And you will do better than the author who has a list of 12 things and they try to do them all. And they do them all haphazardly. Or you’ll do at least as well. Maybe you won’t do better, but you’ll do at least as well. And you’ll come out at the other end feeling okay, and that you can maintain this. Because we all know that after the launch, you are not done. That’s just the beginning, right? Book marketing is this marathon. Book promotion is a guest that is moved into your house, whether or not you’ve made them welcome. So set the boundaries, let them know what the house rules are, and let them live with you. So choose the guests that you can live with.

Carla King 9:25

Yeah, I do know so many authors–including myself–who have been promoting the same book for over a decade. And as an indie author, there are ebbs and flows. There might be stuff in the news, or trends that happen, that boost sales. And you can take advantage of those when it happens, and just let it lie when it doesn’t.

Anne Janzer 9:47

Exactly. Yeah. We’re not done. We keep supporting these books. And so you better feel comfortable in the ways that you support them. You better be doing something that you’re comfortable with. The counterpart to that advice is don’t be afraid to discover new strengths. Book marketing–you maybe have never given talks before or done podcast guesting. How do you know if you’re any good at it unless you try it? So this is a wonderful opportunity to actually grow your skills, explore things. So you need to try to balance that open mind–willing to learn–and try not taking on everything in the universe. And that’s the critical balance. And when you can find that you have a sustainable writing life–a sustainable author’s life.

Carla King 10:36

Right. And checking sales figures. I remember when I launched my last book, I kept checking the sales figures. It was so depressing to do that. And I thought, ‘Okay, this can’t be true. I’m gonna go over here to Nielsen and check to see if the Amazon thing is true.’ It was making me insane.

Anne Janzer 10:56

We really need to be careful. I think we get a little dopamine hit from seeing a sale, right? So you get in this cycle of just feeding the wrong brain chemicals.

Carla King 11:07

And social media engagement, too. Facebook likes, and etc.

Anne Janzer 11:13

I like to think of all of that data–sales data, the likes, all of that–is like the wake of a ship, and not the ship itself. So when you’re tracking it, you’re paying a lot of attention to the wake to see where it’s been. But we really need to be focused on the people. We really need to be focused on the people on that ship. Where’s the ship going? Those are our readers.

And focusing too much on that data, I think, makes us chase the wrong things. It makes us think of, ‘How can I get those clicks up? How can I spur more sales?’ And sales are a little bit of a different issue, because they are a more direct reflection of immediate behavior. But, ‘How can I chase that data?’ Rather than, ‘How can I serve my readers? How can I provide value to the readers? How can I be generous? How can I see where people are going and what they need, and show up there? So you need to put some limits around that checking.

Carla King 12:19

And you know, I saw this podcast with you–I think it was Draft2Digital. You were talking about servant authorship. And that feels like what you’re talking about now. Can you explain that and what that is?

Anne Janzer 12:34

So this is a philosophy that I find so useful in writing my books, and in promoting my books. Which is simply this–that I think of myself as writing to serve others. Whenever I’m writing, it’s, ‘Well, how does this serve the reader?’ This comes from a parallel in the business world of servant leadership, where we say that the leader isn’t there to promote themselves and aggrandize themselves, but to serve the people that they lead.

And as an author, as a writer, we are there to serve our readers. And what this does is–it takes the pressure off. It takes that self referential pressure, ‘Oh, my god, am I gonna look stupid? Is this enough? Am I any good?’ And it takes that out of the equation, because you’re really focusing on what people need. And it guides you in everything from what to put in the book–maybe even what publishing path to take. ‘What’s the publishing path that’s going to serve my reader?,’ is a really legitimate question. And, of course, it helps to infuse the book promotion. ‘How do I get this book in front of the people that it’s really going to best serve?’ That is what book marketing is about.

Really, marketing is about matching a product and getting it to its audience. And that’s a generous thing not a, ‘Buy my book, buy my book,’ thing. It’s a generous thing.

Carla King 13:59

I love that. And it makes sense–what you said about, ‘Don’t look so much at the wake.’ But you have to look at the wake sometimes to see if you’re serving the right people. When is the time to do that?

Anne Janzer 14:13

We always want to learn. We want to get the feedback. So there are hints in the wake to the feedback. If people respond to an email or a podcast interview, then you know that you’ve you’ve resonated. And so that is important. The issue is it so quickly becomes addictive. So unless I’m actually running a specific book promotion campaign, and I want to see–let’s say I’m doing a discount. I’m going to watch those sales day to day, because I want to see how it’s doing–to learn. But otherwise, I think it’s safe to do a monthly check of your sales, and tally up those numbers. Put some boundaries around it for your own personal mental health, and also where you put your focus and your time. So track the data, but don’t live by the data.

Carla King 15:06

Right. And I notice that I get a lot of validation–or I feel like I’m in service–when I get replies to my email marketing. Which has become less marketing these days than just talking to the people that have been there for a long time.

Anne Janzer 15:27

Yes, that’s the secret of it. What you’re trying to do–and there’s irony, Carla–because I decided my first book was about marketing. And it did really well. But then I thought, ‘I’d like to write about writing, because you know what, I don’t want to spend my life in marketing.’ ‘What do you do as an author?’ ‘Oh, marketing.’

So one of the quarters of that book is that it’s really about the relationship. We’re moving to a business world where people aren’t just buying widgets or something–buying books. They are finding value in the relationships that they find. So as you say your newsletters go out and people respond, it’s because you’re actually in a relationship. You’re building trust, you’re exchanging communication. And that is really valuable. I mean, other people could write a book on your topic, but other people won’t have that relationship that you have with your readers.

Carla King 16:18

You know, that’s right. A lot of authors–they write a book, and then they second guess and go, ‘Well, wait. There’s 10 other books by famous people here. Why did I write this book?’ How do you talk to these people?

Anne Janzer 16:32

If you really bring yourself to your book. If you are really not just writing, ‘Oh, here’s all the stuff I know,’ but really writing yourself into the book, then yes, of course, it will be–this maybe on the same topic–but it will be uniquely you, and it will show up to a different group of people. The people that you resonate with, that you build that relationship with. My best known book is a book about writing. Well, geez, there’s a few books about writing out there in the world, and I love a bunch of them. So it’s not like I’m thinking, ‘You know what the world needs?’ But, I was really passionate about this psychology of writing. And I thought, ‘I think there are people who would find this really helpful.’ So if you focus on that servant authorship, it really helps you find your angle–your specific reason for writing, and the way it’s going to land in the world.

Carla King 17:30

And that’s you being your authentic self and reaching people–just being authentic. Which is maybe how you have to decide what social media channels to use, etc. I saw somebody who said he just published Instagram reels–one a day for a month, just see how it felt? I’m trying to remember who this was now. But he was like, ‘I’m not going to do it again. But it got easier. Now I can do it every once in a while when I think it’s appropriate.’

Anne Janzer 18:15

So let’s talk about social media. Because here’s where we land in that world of FOMO–or fear of missing out–right? And so what I like about what this guy did was–he said, ‘I’m going to do this experiment. And I’m going to see if this is a strength, or make it a strength.’ And I think it’s useful to approach book marketing in this way. It’s like, ‘Well, that’s interesting. I’m going to see.’ I’ve talked to people who just hate–they absolutely hate hate hate–being on video. Well then, don’t try to do video, right? Easy enough. I mean, if you try it, and you can get past that, and you discover it’s okay, that’s fine. But if not, don’t do it.

Some people just can’t spend time on social media. Then fine–that’s not going to be part of your platform. You’re going to need to have other strengths in place to take care of that instead. Should we all be on BookTok, right? You brought that up. I have given myself permission to say, ‘That would be fascinating. And when I have time, maybe I’ll look at it, but I have other more important things to look at right now. And that’s okay for me.’ But I’m also willing to look at what people do and learn from it. And this–I think–is the mindset that authors need to bring when we go to the Nonfiction Authors Association and see all this fantastic advice. Or we go to the conference–and I know there’s going to be wonderful stuff there that I want to learn. Go with an open learning mind, but recognize you’re just going to have to tier and slot in what you want to experiment with, and what you want to try.

Try it on like a pair of shoes–’Does this fit me? Do these hiking boots make my feet bleed as I go on with them?’ Don’t wear them, right? So let’s see what works. And you are in control of that– you are the judge of that, and not what everybody says you should be doing. So be willing to question established wisdom about book marketing–be willing to do that. If you do it from a place of a deep understanding of your strengths, your book, your audience, those are the guiding principles that you should use to determine what fits you or not.

Carla King 20:37

And a month feels, to me, like a good amount of time. Am I getting results, or am I not? Right? Is this fun, or is it not?

Anne Janzer 20:47

Yes.it takes a while to figure out–if something’s new to us. So I like that he gave it a month, and a month of every day. He came out knowing something more about himself, about the process, and about skills that he might use later. So he might do one reel a month, or he might do reels around a book launch. Or who knows what he’ll do. He’s got something in his toolkit, but he knows where it fits.

Carla King 21:13

I can’t believe we’re almost out of time. Do you have any last tips before we sign off?

Anne Janzer 21:19

Just try to approach book promotion and book marketing with the same creativity that you approach writing your book. I think that’s my best advice. And try to put it in that framework, because too often we feel stressed out about it. And if we say, ‘Wait, no, I’m going to be creative. I’m going to experiment. This will be fun and interesting,’ it changes our relationship to it, and it becomes something that we can really inhabit in our writing lives.

Carla King 21:51

Thanks for that. And finally, one more question. Can you tell us a little bit about the session at the Nonfiction Writers Conference that you’re leading?

Anne Janzer 22:01

I am leading a session on doing discount book promotions. So this was one of my learning experiences early on for my first book. I said, ‘I’m gonna experiment with sales.’ My first sale was a terrible disaster. And nobody came. But I kept cycling through. It’s like, ‘Well, maybe I need to do this, maybe I should do this.’ I kept building and experimenting, and I’ve come up with processes.

And I think this has been a really important part of the way that I’ve built my readership, because it helps me find and reach people outside of my normal circles. So I’m sharing with you my processes on how to do that. And if you are interested, come and listen. But again, listen to it through this: ‘Well, would I be willing to spend a little time experimenting like this? Does this sound interesting to me? Can it be a fun puzzle?’ If so, you can consider adding it to your book marketing strategies.

Carla King 23:01

Thank you. I’m totally interested in it, because I haven’t done it that much. So I’m really looking forward to seeing what your system is. Thank you so much for being here, again. I really just appreciate you, and your talks, and your podcasts, and interviews, and all your books, which are so useful. So thanks for those.

Anne Janzer 23:23

Thank you, Carla.

Carla King 23:24

And you can find Anne at annejanzer.com. Thank you to our listeners for joining us today and every week. For a list of guests and topics, check our events page at NonfictionAuthorsAssociation.com, where you’ll find extensive show notes, links, and transcripts for the podcast and also a list of webinars, courses, and other events. You won’t believe how many free reports we have for you to help you write, publish, and market your book and do business as an author. You just have to subscribe.

Until next week, this is Carla King with a reminder to keep writing, the world needs your experience and expertise.

Quotes from our guest

“Don’t be afraid to discover new strengths. Book marketing–you maybe have never given talks before or done podcast guesting. How do you know if you’re any good at it unless you try it? So this is a wonderful opportunity to actually grow your skills, explore things. So you need to try to balance that open mind–willing to learn–and try not taking on everything in the universe. And that’s the critical balance. And when you can find that you have a sustainable writing life–a sustainable author’s life.”

“As an author, as a writer, we are there to serve our readers. And what this does is–it takes the pressure off. It takes that self referential pressure, ‘Oh, my god, am I gonna look stupid? Is this enough? Am I any good?’ And it takes that out of the equation, because you’re really focusing on what people need. And it guides you in everything from what to put in the book–maybe even what publishing path to take. ‘What’s the publishing path that’s going to serve my reader?,’ is a really legitimate question. And, of course, it helps to infuse the book promotion. ‘How do I get this book in front of the people that it’s really going to best serve?’ That is what book marketing is about. Really, marketing is about matching a product and getting it to its audience. And that’s a generous thing not a, ‘Buy my book, buy my book,’ thing. It’s a generous thing.”

“ If you focus on that servant authorship, it really helps you find your angle–your specific reason for writing, and the way it’s going to land in the world.”

“Be willing to question established wisdom about book marketing–be willing to do that. If you do it from a place of a deep understanding of your strengths, your book, your audience–those are the guiding principles that you should use to determine what fits you or not.”